Feeling oddly guilty

[1badboy 581]

 

I've been feeling oddly a little guilty lately.  Probably in part because I'm a little sick. 

I'm an atheist, but I used to be a very 'conservative' Christian.  And I wrote a story titled "Full Bush", where my character became a pastor for a while.  And it got me into thinking about 'morality'.  Not 'Christian' morality, but rather how we can live a fulfilling life.  I'm not really any good at writing 'Christian talk' so I just plagurized off the internet.

Anyway, when I was done with that story I didn't feel bad at all about it.  But now weirdly, after the mindset I had writing that, I find myself feeling oddly guilty because of the "immorality" in my subsequent stories.

In my "A Cruel Cruel Summer" story I tried to bury what was really going on with my characters inferiority complex.  It was supposed to be dark humor because 'Rich' actually believed all the insane things the girls were saying -- and they were just being really bad and messing with him.  And then there was the lack of monogamy -- which weirdly makes me feel guilty too...

Do you ever feel guilty because of this fetish?  It's more of a dark humor fantasy to me -- because I know better than actually doing these things in real life.  Some naughty peeing though would be pretty harmless.

I don't know, maybe I sort of changed my mindset when I wrote 'Full Bush', and put me back into my old Christian mindset?  I almost feel guilty that there is no redeeming value in my "A Cruel Cruel Summer".

 

 

[gldenwetgoose 21,487]

Sounds quite similar to my background to be honest - and although I've done that complete U turn like you, there are still a number of legacies with me.  Generally not swearing for one (although I have my occasional outbursts).  Every so often I come into contact with the holier-than-thou brigade and am reminded that I think I very much made the right decision.

For me the biggest 'guilt' trip comes with the interaction between this 'hidden' life and my everyday life.  By hidden I mean there's the part of my life that needs to be fulfilled and in the past, I've proven cannot be pushed aside. It will raise it's head - the itch that needs to be scratched.  In everyday life I'm incredibly privileged to have spent nearly a quarter of a century with the lady who is my wife - who doesn't and wouldn't tolerate this side of my life.  In some ways we get closer every day, in other ways we've drifted apart.  Certainly the insecurity is gone and with that we've both agreed that certain actions that would break many relationships could be forgiven.

I really don't think my involvement here, the playful chats with friends here or a few real life instances would be understandable though, and if they couldn't be understood would probably not be forgiven or accepted (historic evidence of one very rough patch backs that up).   So keeping this hidden is something I do sometimes struggle with.

This community has helped ease a lot of my guilt - I know I'm not alone, not a freak (or at least I'm part of a large freak circus).  Some may consider my interactions as a form of cheating and sometimes I do too, or at least keeping my own secrets unshared.  I have closer friendships here that I do with most other real world friends and that evaporates my guilt.  Mostly.

[likesToLick 10,216]

11 hours ago, 1badboy said:

Do you ever feel guilty because of this fetish? 

Absolutely never.

My standard for ethical behaviour is based on "be kind to others and do them no harm."  Nothing about enjoying women's pee is harmful, and often I can give them pleasure too. 

I do not concede that anyone at all has a right to judge my sexual preferences, and I try hard not to judge those of others.

I'm also an atheist,  so the concept of "sin"  does not exist for me. 

 

 

[Bacardi 10,134]

I dont really ever feel guilty. More like a deviant. I actually had another sexual deviant crisis moment a few months ago when someone struck up a conversation with me on here and I realized we both hide our fetish for the same reasons. I too have a Christian background and grew up in a purity culture. I 100 percent believe it contributes to my shyness about sex and my asexuality. It's hard for me to talk about sex in general (face to face with people I know anyway), and when you throw in a fetish people don't always have, one that I've been shamed to my face about before, it just makes me feel like an outcast. 

Does my enjoyment of piss make me feel guilty? No. I don't feel like it's something I shouldn't have. But does it sometimes make me feel like an "other?" Yeah. Absolutely.

[Alfresco 11,631]

Very good question @1badboy and seeing as you have been good enough to bring it up and to outline your position, I will try and explain my position, which is not dissimilar to yours in many ways.

Firstly, I am a Christian - was brought up in a church background, and I still have a relationship with God, but I rarely go to church as I've not found one that I am comfortable in.   I'm not going to go into the details here as that is not the point of the thread or the site.  However, I can say that I have certain things that influence my way of living including having strong respect for others, not wishing to do anything that would harm anyone else and things like being polite to people and not swearing.

I sometimes feel that I'm doing something that might be slightly morally wrong by searching out and watching girls peeing outside, but I don't feel guilty as such because it is them that have chosen to pee in a public place.  However, I do sometimes worry about the consequences if the police tried to read anything too much into what I do.

I don't feel guilty about peeing in the non toilet places that I do, because I don't believe I'm doing anyone any harm.   Maybe occasionally I have the odd pang of guilt if I've peed a bit too much in a hotel room or something like that, but generally I restrict my peeing to what I believe won't cause any lasting problems or serious inconvenience.  Peeing in a car park stairwell or an underpass or a public place isn't going to cause a major problem for anyone and there are probably many people without a pee interest who have peed in those same stairwells and underpasses without thinking about it, just because their bladders were full.   I did feel slightly guilty when I absolutely soaked a train seat - well not at the time, but more when I had got off the train.

I love the stories that include wanton pissing on furniture and carpets, but I tame that down in my real life - I would love to do more of that, but I think I would feel guilty if I did.   Interestingly, I love watching the videos of girls who totally pee all over hotels and shops or merchandise, but I don't feel guilty about that - probably because I figure that I'm not the one making the mess and if they've already done it then I may as well enjoy watching.

The one that is really strange is that I can spend ages watching videos and reading stories getting turned on, but then if I come, then the same videos afterwards seem less sexy and more unacceptable.   I guess once the sexual drive is taken away, I watch them in a more practical sense rather than watching them for the pleasure.   Simple answer - once I've come, stop watching!!

As for stories that I've written (and yes, I know it has been a long time.....) I'm happy to write about girls peeing where they leave a mess without caring and whilst I try to write on a level where it is conceivable that the girls would actually pee in that situation, I do take it a bit further than I would do myself at times.   I don't tend to go as far as piss vandalism, as that is not really my thing, but I'm certainly very happy (and not guilty) writing about girls peeing on pub seats and carpets or in a train or public building and them getting pleasure out of doing it.

Do I feel guilty about hiding any of what I do from my wife?   Generally no.   She knows of my interest in pee, she will indulge me from time to time and she has told me that she doesn't mind me watching other girls pee as long as I don't tell her about it.   By extension of that, I don't tell her much about my own peeing in "naughty" places and I don't tell her that I spend time looking at things on the internet.  However, she is not stupid and given that she knows of my interest in watching girls pee, I'm guessing that she must have at least an idea that I look at this on the internet but prefers not to know the details.  She knows that I pee outside regularly, but probably not quite how much.   I don't think that she knows that I've peed on carpets in hotel rooms and corridors etc., and every now and again I feel guilty that I'm doing that in secret, but on the other hand she has told me she doesn't want to know, so that's fair enough.   I am thinking that some of those things would be a step too far for her and best not discussed, although she is quite happy to pee in hot tubs and swimming pools and even a pool changing room floor drain, and she accepts peeing outside when needed, I don't think she would approve of peeing indoors.   

So, all in all I do have the odd pang of guilt, but I'm mostly comfortable with the level of pee interest that I have.

 

[Kupar 13,339]

I can quite understand feelings of guilt. But isn't much of religious faith built around creating that feeling in you by setting down absolute rules about what is right and wrong? I think questions of absolute and relative moral codes could become quite complex very quickly and I did not study ethics, so I am not going to set myself up to be knocked down by those with real insight and expertise (the range of expertise in so many areas among the membership here is incredible!)

However, it's quite likely that most PF members experience some level of discomfort (= guilt) about going against cultural norms (or the law, or others' moral codes, or their own innate or learned codes). Learned codes can be unlearned to a certain extent I reckon.

When I have time I will draw up a chart of 'Kupar's analysis of the pee fan's moral dilemma' ... a simple 2x2 with "external moral context (never allowed to always allowed)" on one axis and "personal view of naughtiness (from destructive / intrusive to careful / private on the other). There are many others here who would do a better job than I would, but perhaps plotting the different types of pee-related activity on such a chart might help you draw some (literal) boundaries around what you want to do, or at least think through the issues.

Thanks for raising such an interesting subject, and good luck with feeling comfortable.

Edited November 15, 2021 by Kupar
Just making it better

[Eliminature 5,209]

Not a Christian, but I am a synagogue attending Jew (not Orthodox). Do I feel guilty from a religious point of view? Nope. As long as you don't commit adultery, rape, or deliberately sexually abuse someone, not much is off limits in Judaism with regards to sex. It was actually a Jewish man, Ernst Graffenberg, who first described what is now known as the G spot and came up woth an early type of coil so that married couples could have sex without risking pregnancy. Needless to say, being a German Jew in the 30s, most of his work was suppressed. 

Do I feel guilty from a moral point of view? Sometimes. Causing a big mess for someone to clean up doesn't arouse me whatsoever. Neither does peeing on furniture or carpet - possibly due to getting a good smack when I did that as a child. Peeing outside feels liberating and freeing, though. As does peeing standing up. Sometimes I think to myself "Why am I like this? Why can't I just be turned on by normal things? Being fascinated by peeing is childish, am I still at an emotionally immature stage?" But there are much worse things to be turned on by. Peeing outside, being watched and watching others is harmless in the grand scheme of things. 

[1badboy 581]

Is it rebellion?  My writing seems to be making me more aware of the morality I am comfortable with -- like monogamy.   I find even porn more gratifying if there is ultimately monogamy.

And I find stories more gratifying if at least one 'enemy' is befriended rather than defeated.  

I wish I had known -- when I was younger -- what I know now.  And Christianity oddly didn't provide much of that wisdom.

[Kupar 13,339]

9 minutes ago, 1badboy said:

I wish I had known -- when I was younger -- what I know now

You and all of us, my friend 🫂

[Kupar 13,339]

48 minutes ago, Eliminature said:

Peeing outside, being watched and watching others is harmless in the grand scheme of things. 

Yes indeed 🙂

[Wet Daisy 1]

 

A pee fetish in general I’d fine. I find this kink/fetish to be “kinky” but not overly. Some of the thrill is doing something your “not supposed to do” makes it fun in some ways.  If your not hurting anyone else or yourself. Also, if your doing it in a place we’re everyone is consenting then I see no issue.

The people who pee in public on the carpet, furniture, clothing, other peoples property, etc should feel guilty.  Keep it in your own house or with people who consent.  

 

[1badboy 581]

I don't know, maybe what I don't like about my last story is that none of the characters were really all that likeable. 

Just a bunch of people all behaving badly? Even if they were getting even with Nick, who was a really bad guy.

Sometimes I like to watch Korean dramas as therapy.

[UnauthorisedGuy 510]

@1badboy - your post is timely, because I'm actually having the same debate with myself at the moment. I've written a story for Literotica (not about pee), but I'm undecided about whether to post it or not. The main character does something that is not only morally wrong, it's a crime. Why am I even considering posting it? Because I can separate fantasy from reality - the fantasy of doing this turns me on, though I'd never, ever even consider doing it in real life. I posted a story that contained some of the same elements on a site some years ago, and got a number of emails from women saying how much the story turned them on.

On the other hand, I'm sure there were people who read the story and were offended by it. And I think we're living in a society that seems increasingly unable to separate fantasy from reality. I think fantasies are harmless, but a lot of people think that if you fantasize about something, you'll eventually do it, and also that you condone others doing it. 

So I think I understand where you're coming from. At the moment, I'm still undecided, but if I do post the story, I'm going to feel some level of guilt about it. 

 

 

    

[Kupar 13,339]

7 hours ago, 1badboy said:

I don't know, maybe what I don't like about my last story is that none of the characters were really all that likeable. 

That's a good point. I've declined to watch, even walked out of, films before now when it's clear that there are no likeable characters. Yet I know other people who don't feel like that. It's a deeper emotional question than just naughty pissing for sure! 

[Alpian 687]

Ain't got the time to read the full stories you're refering to, but from what I saw during the last hour, they are well written and interesting. I like the idea of exposing the religious scam that's going on, adding our kink to the story. I'd consider myself a Christian, but I don't think that the churches have a monopoly on defining our relationship to spirituality, and I feel there is a lot of abuse by churches of the poor souls they are supposed to be helping. Just look at how the Roman Catholic church is dealing with the rape and abuse issues they are confronted with... So "Full Bush" is kind of a warning for the unsuspecting lambs falling prey of the self-declared preachers and saviours.

From what I understand, your upbringing has left you with some indelible legacy, and you're pushing the boundaries of those morals when writing your stories. I understand that sometimes comes back to you - ingrained habits and beliefs are hard to root out. And I guess we've all felt the elation that comes with transgression and the excitement of not being caught doing something naughty.

Did you ever contemplate the difference of guilt and shame in the context of your feelings? Thinking of it, I do sometimes feel shame concerning my kink. But that's entirely different to the feelings of guilt elaborated below.

Back to your question. My youth has probably been less morally intoxicated than what you write about yours. But yes, I have at times felt guilty about some of my actions that are driven by my kink. It's along the lines of what @gldenwetgoose and @Alfresco relate, no need to repeat.

Contrary to you though, I have never felt guilty about the stories that I write myself or the fantasies I develop when pleasuring myself. Those include activities and behaviors I'd never tolerate in real life, and that might even repulse me if I read them in someone else's stories. But as I'd never indulge in those things in real life, I know in the deepest part of my soul that no one will get hurt by my fantasies and I can focus on the joy the transgression of boundaries imparts.

An example: In my story "Bunker Break" (currently my only story publicly available), Gillian and Laura significantly abuse - some might say rape - their guide. There's no physical violence involved, but in the face of it, that's what it is. So why did I write it and how does it turn me on? Because I found the pee desperation element arousing, and the idea of kinky women cunningly tricking a girl into engaging in naughty pee scenes she wouldn't have done otherwise. And I always grant Marianne a virtual exit route - she could have changed the turn of things by speaking up - so there is no "hard" violence. Also, I'd love it to happen to me - fresh female pee simply doesn't have anything unpleasant to me, whichever way you turn it. Being abused by Gillian and Laura - it would be a dream come true! It's probably the same thing that lets many women enjoy literary descriptions of rape: they know it's not happening for real, and what's described fits their momentary desire. These women would never want to be raped for real!

A totally different type of guilt is what I feel when enjoying a story involving incest. I'm against incest of any kind for the simple reason that family ties are forever: You can break up with a partner and go your way any time you like, but if things turn sour in an incestuous relationship, it's going to be really ugly for the rest of your life. You simply can't run away from it. So a complete NO for real life incest of whatever kind. But in fiction, it allows to develop storylines that simply can't be spun credibly otherwise. The intimacy between family members, the occasional glimpse of things you're not supposed to find erotic, the openness and complicity that can develop over the years combined with the strong barriers of taboo preventing the blosoming of a sexual relationship... This combination only exists within the family context, thus inspiring plots that are completely different to your typical "acquaintance" type stories. So when coming across one of those stories on literotica, I often hesitate whether I want to read it or not - and sometimes decide to go for it, all the time feeling a secret guilt (around here, this is somewhat illegal, even as a story). But this feeling of guilt is limited, probably because in my family there are no females that could attract me to do (or make me regret not doing / having done) anything similar in real life.

 

PS: I would have appreciated links to your stories in your posting - I found them via the search function, but had I had less time, I might not have bothered, and I'd have missed some great reading!

PPS: Isn't there sort of a monogamic ending to Brooke and Rich going to California in "A Cruel Cruel Summer"? No one stops you from adding monogamic ending for the other girls, if it eased your pain? ... and they lived happily together for the rest of their lives!

Edited November 16, 2021 by Alpian
added PPS

[1badboy 581]

My religious views are definitely controversial. I was banned from five different religious forums -- two Catholic, and three 'Christian'.  And I ultimately decided that they had done me a favor, because I was wasting my time debating various issues.  But I did find that I had a HUGE influence on many people -- and that is kind of scary.   

And curiously Literotica rejected every story I ever submitted.  One of the last stories I posted was Grizzly Mountain.  (I wrote multiple versions, and I think this one was the best).

 

[1badboy 581]

I don't know, this fetish is weird.  I've been messing around on these forums for a long time but I go through periods -- like now -- when I am really not into it.  And I feel a little guilty or shameful.  

Look at how apologetic that band was after their singer peed on that guy.  Honestly I found the whole thing hilarious -- and certainly not a big deal.  But other people don't feel the same.

[Peewee123 1,124]

2 hours ago, 1badboy said:

I've been messing around on these forums for a long time but I go through periods -- like now -- when I am really not into it.  And I feel a little guilty or shameful.  

I’m the same, I go through phases. Like I don’t think I’d thought about it or done anything for about 10 years, then suddenly I remembered and googled and found this site and I’ve had a few months of really enjoying it. Then the last week I’m back to nothing again. 

[likesToLick 10,216]

10 hours ago, 1badboy said:

Look at how apologetic that band was after their singer peed on that guy.  Honestly I found the whole thing hilarious -- and certainly not a big deal.  But other people don't feel the same.

The world seems full of people who become outraged over trivial issues.  I suspect it gives them an excuse to ignore all the serious problems that are going on in society.  (Pollution,  fraud, fascism, wage theft, legal murder etc.)

I regard them with utter contempt,  but I am also careful not to hand them a stick to beat me with.